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Haven



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PostSubject: In game respect   Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:04 am

Hi all,

I have enjoyed playing on your server for the most part. It gives me a chance to practice my flying and the teamwork is generally welcomed. I wanted to mention that as a former admin for a clan, we held respect in the highest regard; respect for Admin, for the rules, and for players. So it should be no surprise when I tell you it's a little disappointing when players are subject to disrespect from other players, but even more so when it's from a TFC clan member. In that case there's nothing they can do about it. They can come in and voice their disapproval, and risk being banned from the server like I'm doing now, or they can speak out in game, and still risk being kicked or banned. I hope you guys can remember that we were all newbies at one time or another. We all had to learn how to do everything about the game there is, whether it be ground pounding, being commander, or flying a chopper or a jet. Nobody comes into the game an expert. It's easy to get caught up in the moment and act 'in the moment'. It takes some practice to step back and remember it's a game, and realize maybe the newbie feels equally disappointed in themselves, let alone having another player or clan member voice it in Voip.

I mean no disrespect here and hope these word find tolerance.

Respectfully,
Haven
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gblanco

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Wed Jan 19, 2011 9:11 am

Haven wrote:
it's a little disappointing when players are subject to disrespect from other players, but even more so when it's from a TFC clan member.

You need to give us more details please.
What kind of disrespect are you talking about ?
What did the admin say ?

Haven wrote:
They can come in and voice their disapproval, and risk being banned from the server like I'm doing now, or they can speak out in game, and still risk being kicked or banned.

You are proceeding respectfuly to explain us your experience in this server.
There is no way you will be banned for this.
There is nothing more punishable in this server than an admin abusing his admin privileges.

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Haven



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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:29 pm

gblanco, check your PMs.
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rleedrums

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 11:29 am

What is this about?
I don't like very much the whole secrecy aspect of this matter. This should be discussed in the open, for multiple reasons.
HAVEN, please spell it out.
GBLANCOV, please enlighten us.
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gblanco

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:07 pm

This is not an intent to single out a particular person and certanly there was no admin abusing his privileges.
The incident is about an admin flying with another player. The other player made some mistakes as pilot and the admin said something in voip.
"This pilot sucks", "how stupid this guy is", etc.
According to Haven the admin was not aware the player was in the same squad and listening.
Haven warned the admin saying "He heard every word you said, he's in our squad." and according to Haven the admin said "good".
Haven and the other player left the squad. That's it.

Haven is just explaining according to his standards this should not happen, so, he just will not squad up with players/admins he finds offensive.

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Haven



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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:28 pm

Small clarification. glbanco, gonna change your word 'warning' to 'informing'. IMO, only an Admin can warn. ;-)
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gblanco

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:29 pm

The most important of what I answered to Haven is.

"When you play this game with passion like most of us do, you eventually say something like that.

Some players feel insulted if they are called "tard"... you will never know when a player could feel insulted.
Sometimes players feel insulted if they make a mistake and you say "Come on, what were you thinking ?".... No insulting words were used, but the player could feel insulted because you are complaining about his skills.

Frustration and passion could be the cause of some players to react in a way we dont like."

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gblanco

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:33 pm

gblanco wrote:
Haven warned the admin.

"Haven informed the admin."

Sorry, english is not my natural language. Smile

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rleedrums

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:44 pm

Putting aside my issue with the original post, which neither identified the culprit(s) nor explained the nature of the disrespectful language, I have this comment:

A fair application of "respect" is certainly a conundrum generally speaking, and even more so here. Not only is it virtually impossible to require and enfore "respect" objectively but also, and more importantly here, it runs somewhat counter to the "Free Speech Server" rule of this very clan. If you are allowed on this server to cuss and curse, by extension you can certainly say that a player "sucks". At least until it is hammered incessantly and repeatedly to the point of reaching the "disrupting player" level, itself a kickable offense on this server.

Even assuming that a =TFC= ADMIN is to be held to a higher standart than a visiting player, from what I understand, the Admin didn't even curse or yell at the player, he simply stated his displeasure with a bad pilot. That might be disrespectful in the general world, it is not here.

HAVEN, my impression is that you are not playing on this server according to its rules. Free speech (with the exception of racism) is the rule here. If you want to play here, which you are of course very welcome to do, you should abide by it. Before joining this Clan, I used to play a lot on the ISI server, a Christian server where absolutely no cursing, racist, bigotted, or disprespectfiul language is tolerated. This is their rule and therefore it can be expected and even requested from their players and ADMINs. Here, since Free Speech is the rule it is, likewise, is to be expected from players and ADMINs alike.

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Haven



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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:01 pm

Quote :
HAVEN, my impression is that you are not playing on this server according to its rules.

Enlighten me. Which rule am I breaking?
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Haven



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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:07 pm

I almost forgot something. My issue was not with the freedom of speech issue. It was about respecting other players. The following is taken of =TFC='s homepage.

- Being respectful to fellow players, particularly =TFC= members, and to our rules of engagement at all times.

Curious... how do you handle a situation, such as this one, when the 2 are contrary to each other?
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gblanco

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:35 pm

Haven wrote:
- Being respectful to fellow players, particularly =TFC= members, and to our rules of engagement at all times.
Haven wrote:
Enlighten me. Which rule am I breaking?

I will give you my interpretation of this.
Drums did not say you were breaking any rule, in fact you did not break any rule.
Drums said you were not playing according to the rules..... To me, according to the rules means "accepting" the rules.
If you are playing in a limited free speech server like this one, you will listen insulting words but you dont accept it according to your standards.
And about being respectful.... like drums said.... "Until a player is hammered incessantly and repeatedly to the point of reaching the "disrupting player" level, itself a kickable offense on this server."
There was no repeatedly insults or insulting words used to a certain level to be considered as an offense.
In fact there was no personal insult because the insulting words were not directed to the player making the mistakes..... the admin did not know the player was listening.
This is my personal opinion.

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madmullet

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Sat Jan 22, 2011 4:23 am

wOw,1+1+1=3. AMAZING
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m1keonline1

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:17 pm

All so many words!!!

All I can say to Haven is

COME BACK AND SHOOT sonof a biatch that made a comment about you & make sure you do it with the weapon or vehicle that they passed comment about.

Its a game and its all good.

Mike
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jason10001

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:54 pm

LOL MIKE!! lol! lol! lol!
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mypaperpast

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Tue Jan 25, 2011 5:27 am

lol....me personally i don't care who is listening or not....if i am flying and my chopper gunner can't hit anything (including a stationary TANK/HOUSE)....then i will voice my opinion.....

i do not mean to be rude or anything but i don't think the TFC server is for "practicing"

i know i have my bad days as well as any other player....those days i stay out of choppers/aircrafts and get my ground hours up...but a player that consistently hops in a chopper/aircraft and doesn't know what they are doing...is a serious risk to the team...
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JP7628

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:58 pm

Agreed, that is why I keep my eye in a scope! cyclops
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usmom

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:18 pm

mypaperpast wrote:

i do not mean to be rude or anything but i don't think the TFC server is for "practicing"


No one can get better if they don't practice. The best way to learn is by doing. Sorry to say but that attitude is one reason why I won't get in a chopper with most of you....I don't want to get yelled at because I know that I'm not very good and miss most of the time.

Lisa
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kidster717

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:00 pm

i actually go to another server to warm up before i go to yours so i don't miss in heli because i get mad when i miss on shots i kno i should of had
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mypaperpast

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:32 am

that is actually how i started in the chopper....i would go to an empty server or load up the Sandbox Mod and practice for hours....then i would go to the populated servers and play
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LordsGuard

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:49 am

If I can put my 2 cents in. I've never played in an empty server. I came in to BF2 quite a few years back and started playing in servers and learned on the fly. I got yelled at quite a bit and some harsh language was exchanged often. Even here at TFC, I can remember one of my first experiances here was flying against rabbit and crashing into him. he proceeded to 'enlighten' me on my 'noobness', we had some words and now play quite nicely together.

What I'm trying to get across here is a couple things;
1) BF2 is a fighting/combat game. the adrenaline tends to flow overboard sometimes.
2) Words are words - we all do it, get it, yell at and get yelled at. Shrug it off
3) NOTHING is better than schooling a person who slanders me. such sweet sweet revenge!

If feelings are hurt, I'm sorry. but it is a free speech server, one of the basic rights we as people have(in most countrys). Suck it up and have some fun....


Just my 2 cents.
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JP7628

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Thu Feb 03, 2011 2:28 pm

Haven all criticism should be taken as constructive whether it hurt feelings or not. Take for example when I was brand new at this game I got so much shit talked to me about not being able to hit the broad side of a barn with a sniper rifle when it was imperative to make the shot count. Now since I took that shit talking as constructive criticism I can hit a running head shot at 400 yrds - (no hacks lol). So players need to take stuff like that with a grain of salt and apply to better their skills.

So that is my two cents.

Cheers! cheers cheers
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Haven



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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Thu Feb 03, 2011 11:14 pm

You know JP...... I gotta hand it to you... you have some sound advice. That's why I let it go... 2 weeks ago. I am glad to see that you're keeping up on the clan's forums, though. Thanks bro.
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JP7628

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PostSubject: Re: In game respect   Thu Feb 03, 2011 11:54 pm

LOL I did not even look at the dates. Anyway there was my two cents! cheers cheers
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